I wonder if he was eating the crusher seeking to address a mineral deficiency You can just offer the plain (unflavored, no molasses) basic Hoffmans Minerals in a feeder/bucket in a covered area and let them help themselves. The biggest issue is the immense amount of dust generated in the stalls. So I called them up and ordered 45 tons of 1/4 inch minus crusher dust with squared edges (not sharp) and had that spread on the remaining half of the paddock. Thank you very much for this information, I am in Colorado, down on the plains, so we dont get a lot of rain, but for sure the snow then the horses runs fall apart. The process involves breaking of collected rocks down to the specific sizes with the help of different rock crushers/machines. All Rights Reserved. By May, you can see that the paddock surface is pretty much toast the grass is growing up from underneath and the gravel has almost disappeared from sinking into the soil and the entire thing will have to be re-done again in August for approximately the same cost ($2000 total including tractor to spread it). By filling in low spots and leveling out your driveway with dirt or gravel before installing these pavers, you create an even, pervious surface . Ive heard from a number of people whove tried both that limestone packs down better. The trench feeding the dry well from the gutter downspout should be 11 feet deep and six inches wide, sloping gradually toward the dry well. Heres what it looked like after the two truckloads of 3/4 inch gravel was spread out: I was happy with this for a few days, and then I started fretting about the fact that there really wasnt much room for them to move around and exercise, yet stay on the gravel. 3. Now Im going to moving my other mare over so wanted to check whats the best footing as I live on Vancouver Island, the place with the most rainfall on the planet. Our horses stay in the barn overnight in winter and are out during the day, and this is reversed in summer so the horses graze when its cooler at night. MSU, Inc. 1,100 lb. Its holding up well though and perhaps they will only need to re-do it every 3-5 years now; since theres such a good base on it now. Part 2. When I showed it to my friend Mitchell, he said the two problems with what I did were (a) I did not use industrial-grade geotextile, and (b) I did not put enough rock and gravel on top of the cloth. In general, delivery is free of charge for distances of up to 10 miles. I live in Chilliwack, so have the same weather as you . from coming into contact with your horses hooves, and then to facilitate the drainage of rainwater away from the surface, so your horses hooves stay drier. The other way to look at the weed issue is from a soil ecology perspective. If you live in a climate that only gets occasional rain, or a short rainy season, then you may be able to just lay either a commercial-grade shielding fabric or a specialized plastic draingrid on top of the hard pan soil, then layer 2-4 inches of 3/4 inch minus pea gravel and top that with a 2-inch layer of 1/4 inch minus limestone gravel, or crusher dust. Work these rocks into. Paul. Gravel is bound to have runoff, so your installation of a French drain was a great idea. However, on the flip side of that argument, here's what a Farrier has to say about why she prefers crusher dust: "As a farrier, my favourite footing in this area is crusher dust. And yes, your farrier is correct but that is one of the reasons I LOVE gravel; it allows the horses to self-trim. And I had to do that every year, for 4 years, until I finally got my friend Mitchell to come in and do it right. I would still do the Nilex barrier cloth as the bottom layer though, and clear down to hardpan. Their paddock is 8000 sq feet, so cost is definitely an issue. If you have all your rock and gravel delivered and on-site, a guy with an excavator (to scrape down to hard pan) and a Bobcat (to spread the rock and gravel) can get all 6 steps done in a day. Thank you for the clear answer , and it is my pleasure to present you an invitation to visit the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia to see the Arabian horses in their first homeland. I heard the local racetrack likes to use it, but they are also grooming the track daily. It doesnt matter how much they churn it up now, by end of June you wont notice a thing is amiss! It can also be called quarter minus, or flume sand. Can be used for landscaping, back fill and mixing concrete. In hindsight, even if I could not afford to remove the topsoil and lay down the proper layers first, I should have dumped 3/4 inch minus gravel directly on the grass (at least 3 inches) and then dumped 1/4 inch minus crusher dust directly on top of the gravel (at least 2 inches deep). Per its name, crushed stone is created by taking larger pieces of stone or rock and crushing it into smaller. material calculator delivery rates #10 Limestone Screenings This is our finely screened crushed grey limestone. Grades of limestone aggregate include: 2- to 3-inch Limestone - primarily a construction grade of Limestone. I think it also depends on the crusher I got one load that was insanely dusty, I was concerned about them inhaling it. Which is less likely to freeze. Id love to see it in person. These are just a few of the many ways limestone can be used: 1. Only consideration is to put down rubber mats on top of the gravel in high traffic areas (eg around feeders) as that is where the horses hooves can punch through the gravel and the geotextile cloth starts to get uncovered in spots. NATIVE SOUTH TEXAS RIVER ROCK. https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/equine-permaculture-in-rainy-climates-system-for-sustainable-pastures/, https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/adventures-in-culvert-drainage-for-my-horse-paddock/, Ginny Interviews Jini for the Interspecies Evolution Podcast, Montaros Emancipation My Freedom is Your Freedom, Heart Opening Meditation with the Herd & Land, Montaros Journey: Healing the Wounded Angry Masculine, Messages from Burdock (Burrs), Raven & The Herd, The Herd Out My Window Esoteric Musings, Laminitis, Cushings, Founder Healing Session for Your Horse, Pain, Injury, Competition Brainwashing & Dissociation, The Geography of Belonging Horses & Love in Zimbabwe. Like you mentioned, 1/4 minus is dense and will definitely not drain as well as a coarser product. After tilling is complete, spread the required amount . In that case, I think it would depend on how your drainage is set up from your stalls A barn with good drainage probably requires a different material under the mats, than a stall with poor/no drainage. Thanks so much Eve, for stopping by and adding your wisdom/experience to this conversation much appreciated! Limestone fits and compresses better, by digging in deeper is better, then relaying on the plastic edging to keep the blocks and limestone in place. It also lasts far longer than mulch. Jini Patel Thompson is a natural health writer and Lazer Tapping instructor. Im so happy I found your website! Material Price Sheet 2016 Stone is sold per ton, Dirt is sold per yard, Minimum 16 Yard/Ton, Delivery Included No material is kept in inventory, Delivery from commercial mining and stockpile yards at discount. That is a good idea however I have an intense dislike of the noise of leaf blowers! I would love to turn one of my higher ground areas into a huge covered area with drainage footing and then 8 inches of sand on top just for them to use to lie down Maybe someday. If you let any organic matter build up, it will break down into soil/mush which will defeat the whole purpose, as your horses will now be standing on a wet surface. Wish I had better news for you! One of the most common uses of crushed limestone is in laying driveways. For example, the price for one yard is around $40 at Mains Landscape Supply. Okay so when you say stall mats were talking about a completely enclosed area 3 walls and a roof, right? Heres all the reasons why I should have done it that way. He suggests you lay down 5-6 inches of a 3-inch minus rock layer first, to provide that hard layer and then put your gravel on top of that, or you will just have to dump the same amount of gravel every year, year after year, because it just keeps sinking. Note: Some people like to put a layer of crusher dust as their top layer, but Ive found the fines in crusher really interfere with drainage, as they form this solid packed layer on top of all the gravel. I think for small, enclosed spaces like that, sand and/or rubber mats would be better because the horse needs to lie down on it. Call for more details. Scrape off the dirty layer (from dirt and small bits of manure) and re-surface/grade. Heres my French Drain post if you need it: Let us know what you decide and how it goes! e.g. Awesome feedback! Im going to pick his oh-so-experienced brain and see if he knows anything we dont already know or has some tips or tweaks that make a world of difference. Because ALL ground sinks and displaces unevenly as weather and moisture changes. And in a paddock entryway with 8 inches total of gravel/crusher. My clients have a rubber mat outside and they feed off of that. A smaller driveway may only require a budget of $300 to $350, while a longer and larger driveway may require up to $60,000 in budget. Heres what 3/4 inch minus looks like and it costs me $700 including delivery: The truck arrived and dumped both loads of gravel near the shelters. So you cannot leave any of this organic matter sitting on your gravel, or else it will quickly break down into a mucky layer that defeats the whole purpose. Its a shame that gravel/aggregate companies around the globe cant use the same, standardized terminology, that would make sharing information and understanding things a whole lot easier for those of us in the UK, Australia, Canada, USA etc! Contact Us, How to Fix a Muddy Yard (Prevent Water Build-Up Tips). The same problem occurs when you shovel manure. This has been SO HELPFUL!!!!! Now lay a layer of large rock or recycled concrete (3 inches wide or larger rock) on top of the Nilex barrier, about 5 inches deep. However, there's a medium between powdered limestone and massive chunks. Or email them to me and Ill upload them: service@listentoyourhorse.com And do you have any pics of the barn you never had to dig out? Arizona River Rock. Will dogs poop on pea gravel? Gravel is extremely simple to put on lawns and offers a long-term solution. It makes total sense though that it would be slippery when wet/freezing. You first have to put a commercial-grade shielding material used in road building like Nilex down on the soil and then lay down the 3-inch rock or recycled concrete (often cheaper), and then the gravel. The process of limestone formation typically occurs in shallow, warm, marine . Paths made of large limestone pavers are also popular, but with big slabs some considerations have to be taken into account. We just had our stable built, with excavation down to the hard soil. You might also want to look into the Paddock Paradise, or, Walking Track system. I want a one time solution with not a massive upkeep. BUT mine have extensive gravelled areas so depending on the area you gravel it may not have much effect, or, it could reduce your farrier bills . But outdoors slightly more tricky over time as wet climate works on absorbancy of chip too besides the urine. There are a couple of ways to create a pea gravel patio: using the bare ground as a base or over a base layer of crushed stone. Alicia. I prefer the smaller tractors since they can maneuver better around posts and corners so there is less hand-finishing work for me to do. Limestone crushed to the 1- and 1/2-inch size, mixed with pulverized limestone, can be used as the layer between the soil and the stone blocks according to the J. However, depending on the surface you lay the crusher dust on, it can also mix easily with the mud and be gone by the next rainy season. INC. - Eighty Four 1016 Pennsylvania 519 Eighty Four, Pennsylvania 15330 (724) 222-4303 Get Directions Kirby Agri 500 Running Pump Road Lancaster, Pennsylvania 17601 717-229-2541 Get Directions So now that I have all the information needed to make a good decision about what is the best paddock surface for horses in a wet, rainy climate its time to look at what Im prepared to spend! Good sleep is an important part of a happy, healthy horse. If you have hard ground underneath, you may be able to get away with 2-3 layers of gravel: Bottom: Large roadbase (3 minus) Larry. So for the 1000 lb plate compactor you rented was that a separate machine? 4 inch Dig 2 inches of lime stone compacted. Do you have any pics you can upload? I tend to scrape old chips off at end of summer because with wind and sun a lot naturally disappear. A couple of months ago (prior to reading this) I leveled the walkout paddock area and laid pea gravel 6 deep under the roof and 4 beyond which will be exposed to a lot of rain in winter. It can pack into a hard surface with limited drainage capacity. (from Kelmor in Chilliwack) We did not do a geo textile cloth (although I had one in my first hog fuel arena). These costs can be double for delivery and spreading of the rock. START. Its usually worth quite a bit of money. It is a material that people are familiar with in almost all parts of the world. Thanks for the great advice, now I have no more muddy mess around the barn! Clear all soft organic soil, grass, down to the compacted subgrade soil. Of course you can always start with that and if its not enough, then add more on top. Wow thats crazy! . If it doesnt work well, then next year, pour concrete and your gravel base is already done. The only other consideration is if you want to bring a heavy truck on the paths in that case you definitely need to go with a layer of 3-inch minus road base, then whatever you want on top of that for your horses hooves. I wish I had better news for you. Crushed Stone Delivery Cost - In 2023 - The Pricer ), they told me that the Cloverdale Racetrack uses limestone gravel for their track. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. It can also be used for mixing concrete. Lime is spread on lawns that are not growing well to help the soil become more hospitable for grass. Visit your local nursery or landscape supply specialist to see what's available in your area. Use Gravel Or Crushed Limestone. You have a Horse Herb & Supplement Shoppe?! ), In the section about using two layers of footing/drainage, Dr. Swinker mentioned using a coarse road base and a finer layer on top. As long as you keep their hay off the sand (hay nets with a large bucket or built in container to catch escaped hay underneath?) 5 inches equals .417 feet You should definitely do that! Neither of these materials work well alone. Horses must consume relatively large quantities of the green or dried plants before the toxic threshold is reached. I dont know if this will help anyone, beyond being aware of it, as Im not sure myself how to prevent it. Hes recovering, but its been a slow, agonizing process. Live and learn! Our rock and gravel delivery services have been used to install driveways, drainage systems, garden paths, roads, and much more. Introduction Video: Customer Reviews: Product Videos: Categories. Quick Answer: Can I Use Limestone In My Dog's Kennel Lake County, IL Crushed Limestone Gravel | Bulk Limestone Pavers And then the cloth gets moved around by their hooves. Lastly, if you want to make your manure-picking way easier (more on this below), or have a bit softer surface for your horses, then add a 2-inch deep top layer of 1/4 inch minus gravel, on top of the 3/4 inch gravel. It also drains well and is easy to hose down. And of course, to prep for concrete you have to do layers of gravel, then the concrete, but it would likely be less gravel/limestone than if you were putting mats right on top of the gravel. Be aware that there are different types of crusher dust and the type that sets up very firm is what I prefer. 2. When you say horse rooms Im assuming you mean stalls or stables? . This is a boarding facility so all my expense. It is the clay that especially packs down so hard the water will not drain through well and just runs off the surface. The sand was dumped and spread about 2 weeks later. In muddy areas, perhaps you would even start with 2-4 quarry spalls (basically what you refer to as a 3 clean rock; clean means doesnt have fines). So the only surface Ive seen work is concrete. Many people refer . He was stunned by the county thinking gravel is non permeable and says they are dead wrong. Thanks you so much! Any advice? With 2400 square feet of gravel, my horses were able to self-trim enough that they only needed the farrier to come out and trim every 5-6 months. Scroll. We recommend using this for the topcoat layer for patios and walls. I started with the crusher fines, but have not been happy with the pee spots, so Ill go back and do the pea gravel, or maybe put some sand down in the pee hole, then the next 2 layers? (normally everything here gets wet from rain, but dries the next day to hard surface). What are the environmental impacts of using a coral reef product? Which is 1/4 minus crushed gravel with the fines (rock dust). I thought I could get a few friends out and spread the gravel using rakes, but when I looked at the size of the piles and realized how heavy the gravel was, I decided to hire a local farmer to come spread it for me. The frequency of adding more gravel depends on the activity level of your horses. I have since left that boarding place, but the owners (who bought their own horses after being inspired by mine) did indeed dump 4 more boxes of crusher dust on that paddock ($1400). Heres all the things I did not anticipate, so you can benefit from my learning curve: 1. Do not just go buy geo-textile cloth from your local nursery or hardware store (tried that, doesnt work!). Even in the wettest of environments, a wooden boardwalk will keep your feet dry, and it is simpler to construct than a concrete path. PRICING - State Crushing Landscape Supply Of course here in our dry part of California I dont really need it but thought it might really help some of you in the wetter climates? You can order bulk limestone in Virginia today! I guess it goes back for centuries in the European countries and the lady that wrote the list was from Scotland. I havent used chalk limestone at all. All I had to do was put fresh on top. I also have access to granite based stone dust and of course limestone and just about any other rock, sand or clay material. This is fascinating! How to Lay a Crushed Limestone Driveway | Home Guides - SFGATE We dont have as much rain as you all in the NW but we do have LOTS of hills and so we get drainage across our fields. I am also a muddy hillside east Tennessee horsefarm owner. Approximately 9 cu. It is still porous so urine soaks through reducing the need for bedding removal. In order to safely use limestone for landscaping, remember these points, and your garden will thrive: 1. Im less concerned with the following years, since I may not even be there. You now need to compact your paddock surface use a tamping/compacting machine and water the gravel between tamping to make sure it compacts down well. Or for sure you will be re-doing every year. Ground always shifts. Also be sure and check out our French Drain post as that worked brilliantly and may replace your trench: https://listentoyourhorse.com/paddock-mud-or-flood-problems-install-a-french-drain/. The cost per yard can start at $30 and go up to $45. Thanks for the response. If you are already starting with fairly hard footing underneath, crusher dust may not be your best option but on the Lower Mainland and Fraser Valley [of BC, Canada], it is rare for it not to be an improvement.. I would suggest a coarse, crushed quarry rock or crushed drain rock for a base rather than drain rock or pea gravel, especially for an area getting a lot of traffic. Add more gravel from time to time. And the only thing you can do to remedy it is to pour concrete on top of your gravel thats my ultimate plan, when I have my own place and enough $$ to do so. So the plan is just to do stall mats in the 1212 stall areas. They are then free to honor their body wisdom and *listen* to their body because they are not in physical or psychological scarcity. So 6 = .5 feet, or 3 = .25 feet. (Aggregate = rocks; permeable = allows water to pass through.). Thanks so much for your help! But Im afraid the only thing that is maintenance-free is concrete! Ah glad you found it Lawrence! The result is a durable, all-weather surface that is acceptable for animals.. Thought it was super great idea and she layered it with old hay/brush/sticks and other stuff (hence the lasagna reference) and said it had held up for two winters now! So they obviously had serious deficiencies (their hooves were pretty bad too and thin tails). And repeat, ongoing. When youre scraping the soft soil off (see step 2 below) try to grade the area so water will be encouraged by slope and gravity to flow where you want it to. Agtec Geocell Ground Grid Paver - (8.4ft x 27.4ft x 2in) Crusher dust is gravel that has been crushed to the size of 1/4 or less. I know nothing about it, so Im just asking you questions to stimulate your thoughts/research. So I want to lay down some kind of surface footing that will encourage water drainage and help keep my horses hooves drier, so we can avoid thrush and other hoof problems that are common in this rainy climate. I redid an arena 4 years ago and after MUCH research we went the 3 minus with an arena mix of sand and fine gravel on top. Great article. Using these products together will prevent freezing by allowing for proper drainage without needing a french drainage system. Crushed Limestone Driveway Pros and Cons - Designing Idea Limestone | Types, Properties, Composition, Formation, Uses You can use this scraped-off earth to create a nice hill for them to climb/play on in their pasture, which will also create an area of high ground to stand or lie on during winter. Your email address will not be published. Horse was very lame. Top soil has been removed and 2-3 stone laid down with willow or other non-poisonous wood chips laid on top to depth of 6-12. But, if its drier and they do lie down in there, then yes, a really small, smooth pea gravel or sand would be WAY more comfy for them. They dont lie down in there and only really use it for a shelter. Next, on top of the 3 rock, spread another 5 inch deep layer of 3/4 inch minus gravel (sometimes called Road Base). I know several stables that just dump fresh crusher dust on their paddocks every year to replenish the surface because they didnt follow the steps I outlined above, they just dump the crusher right on the earth. There are many opinions of course as to which is best, in fact it can be a bit overwhelming at times so I would appreciate any guidance. But if your horses have slow feeders in their walk-in shelters, that is not an issue. Again, this article is fantastic! Its good to know that packing it down like that can make such a difference though, I will definitely keep that in mind. Answer 2B and 2A are identical except that the 2A contains a small amount of Limestone dust (10) mixed in with the stone, which allows it to compact more effectively. I think your climate is a lot drier though and you get snow/ice most of the winter, right? 9 Ways to Use Crushed Limestone | Port Aggregates, Inc. The most common concern about using crusher dust which is just tiny, crushed gravel is whether it will be too sharp for the hooves. I want a common sandy area as well so they can enjoy a good roll with no dust. Well, I laid the paddock footing in August. But trying to clean gaps in rubber mats that are shifting as the ground shifts, becomes a BIG hassle. See more related content in our article about, Pros and Cons of Prefinished Hardwood Flooring. HOW are these plants, actually helping or addressing an imbalance in your soil? DIY Pea Gravel Patio | Lowe's 2. I have a paddock area that has nothing but mud now, especially after heavy rains and whenever the snow melts. Sand and Gravel in Covington, St Tammany Parish, Louisiana | Order your The crushed drain rock is going to roll more than the quarried rock. What do you think?I will have gravel drains or hydro blow running across the roads to drain them- Really appreciate your help-. Its uses include: On Bike Paths. Dont be tempted then to just throw more gravel down, thinking its got a good base now. 3/4 in. But as mine are so hard on footing, and theres so many of them lunging around, I have to level and add more crusher every year or two. It needs to be deep enough that the rock compacts and locks together so one layer (of 3 rock) is not enough. I was at a different stable where the horses just pulled up the barrier after digging down to it. Over the last two years we have found that the compacted chalk works well under a straw bed inside. By the time the following May/June rolls around, the sacrifice field will be rejuvenated and Ill flip them again. crushed limestone for muddy yard Spreading temporary ground cover for mud, like pine flakes, crushed limestone, or feline litter, will absorb the mud and also allow you to shovel it bent on remove the excess water. Hi Natasha, I think that will get you through at least 1-2 winters (in the worst rainy climate). The product is commonly used as erosion control, as a heavy drainage material, as a stabilizer or for landscaping.